The billboard (July-Dec 1898)

mm THE BILLBOARD 3 1 I bcre, 1,552; from advertisers. 976; from dis- tributors, not members, and seekers after in- formation, 421. During the same time I have sent out let- ters as follows: To members, 1,544; to ad- vertisers, 934; lists of members sent to ad- vertisers, 421; to distributors, not members, and seekers after information, 418; postal cards sent out, 495. During this time I have paid as postage dues. $L68. The items of expense may be summed up as follows: Postage $30.25 Express charges ............ ............... 2.65 Service of stenographer ...... 2.00 Office expenses, books, paper; ink and pens ... .-.-. 3.05 Total expenditure ......... . ...$87.95 During the past year I have received from the Secretary-Treasurer the sum of $87.25. During the year I have placed work with the members at different points to the amount of $687.33, and at the present time am placing it in Pennsylvania, (with the ex- ception of Pittsburg and Philadelphia), and 1 am sure that our members will all have their share of work this fall. It is not my intention or desire to censure any member for neglecting to report prompt- ly any new work or inquiry, he may receive concerning work, but I would recommend the passage of an article, .for insertion in our constitution and by-laws, making it compul- sory for a. member to report at least every thirty days. This would enable this office to Issue a list of tips that would be strictly up to date. I have been fortunate in settling several matters between the advertiser and the dis- tributor without having recourse to the Ex- ecutive Committee, with a probable: loss to the association. I have found it necessary to prefer charges against one or two of our members, and have referred the papers to the Executive Commit- tee for action. Trusting I have covered the ground to your satisfaction. I remain. Yours fraternally, W. H. CASE. Soliciting Secretary. President: Tou have heard the report. What is your pleasure? L. H. Ramsey: Mr. President, I move that the report of the Soliciting Secretary be re- ceived and adopted as read. The motion being duly seconded, was put before the house by the President, and unani- mously adopted. Mr. Tin-ill: Mr. President, I think if the Soliciting Secretary has preferred charges against any of the members of this associa- tion, the names should be read out. I there- fore move that the Soliciting Secretary pro- ceed to the reading of as many charges as he has in his possession. The motion, after being duly seconded, was put to the vote of the house by the President, and unanimously carried. Soliciting Secretary, (referring to letters!— First, we have a charge against J- H. Beltz, advertiser, signed by Wilford Hope. (Reads letter.) The only defense he appears to make is his letter, which I now read. (Reads let- ter.) These are all the papers I have in this case. Member: Mr. President. I believe'Mr. Geo. M. Leonard has some information on that particular case. Mr. Leonard Mr. President, I will state for the benefit of the members that I went to Scranton. Pa., in February or March, and stopped at the Hotel German. I sent out a dozen letters inquiring who the prominent distributors were, and was answered back by all that Reese & Long. were. I went to this man's house, walked two blocks in the mud, did not find him, and could gain no informa- tion. I made inquiry at a grocery store and a drug store, and was informed that he dis- tributed his bills by sending them out with boys. Afterwards, these communications were sent to me to present here. The first complaint was made under oath; the man who makes the written, defense has not done so under oath. Mr. Hill: Mr. President, it occurs to me that under Art. IX. of our constitution we are superseding our authority by taking this matter away from the Executive Committee. President: I gather this idea, that the statement should probably come before the Executive Committee, but when we are as- sembled in convention, we are the' Executive Committee—we include, the whole. _ . Secretary reads a" letter from Charleston, S. C. . ' Some time ago Mr. Keogh. wrote me a let- ter, saying that Hood and Miles had taken their work.away. I wrote, asking what he had done, as these two firms 'were slow- in taking their work away from any one. Secretary reads letter from Dr. Miles, stat- ing that the charge was made against Keogh because work was not being done in a proper manner, and failing to meet their representa- tive, Mr. Keogh stating that he did not have time to talk to Dr. Miles* agent- Mr. Hill: Mr. President, the greatest trouble we have is that men come into this association and then they get to feel that they are little gods: when an advertiser comes along, he has to get down on his knees to them. I make it my business to get to the advertisers as quick as possible, and I think the sooner these men find out their business the better it will be for all of us. President: I heartilv agree with the Exec- utive Committee in this matter, and the sin- gle proposition. "He hadn't time"—that alone makes him unworthy of membership in this association. A man to hold a membership here must be just as prompt in attending to a message left on a slate as any other—that much attention Is due from him to the asso- ciation, if not to the message. Soliciting Secretary: I have another charge of such a bulky nature, I think it had best be referred to the Executive Committee— •gainst A. P. Phillips. Conneaut. O. President: The Secretary had better read one or two of the letters. One letter was read, making charges, and the answer of Phillips. A portion of another letter was read, bear- ing on the same subject, the right of fran- chise In a district which had been transferred, and now in all probability two men are doing Mr. DeLong. distributing there; There must be some law along this line. Mr. Curran: The situation is somewhat similar to the one in Pueblo. We claim the franchise there. This man Mitchell worked for us and did all that he could to undermine us, until I was forced to put him out, then he started in, in opposition, and in about six months we bought him out. and I sent a copy or the bill of sale to the Secretary: also a copy of the letters and everything else. President: I have heard all of this case, becretary: Mr. President, the reason that was not voted upon, I find that sending a complaint to the Executive Committee to be acted upon is a long piece of work. I further state that I saw the bill of sale, etc., and I believe Mr. Curran is in the right, and owns the franchise. President: I would say that I think Mr. bteinbrenner has never failed to send me re- ports, and I have undertaken to settle a great many, and have settled a great many cases; when we have to go around to look up the members of the Executive Committee, it takes a great deal of time. Mr. Steinbrenner then read the minutes of the preceding meeting. Mr. Hill: Mr. President, I understand from the report just read that the President was empowered to approve of bonds offered by the association. It should have been made by the Secretary and Treasurer to the association. President: I have never had the pleasure or honor of signing any bonds for the asso- ciation or for Mr. Steinbrenner. If there were any bonds required, he would have no trouble in obtaining them. The association has re- quired no bond. I was the person who raised the question of a bond, but it was neglected and knowing the condition of the Treasury all the time, I did not feel that bonds were needed. Mr. Leonard: Mr. President, as on.- asso- ciation is not incorporateo, a bond would be no good. As far as Mr. Steinbrenner is con- cerned, any loss to the association incurred through him I stand ready to make It gooes. Mr. Leonard further stated that he thought in time the association would grow to such immense proportions that it would have to hs incorporated, and when that time comes there will be money enough in the Treasury. President: I want to tell Mr. Leonard that he was appointed on a committee for that purpose, and was not here to hear of his ap- pointment- Minutes of last meeting "approved, - ~" President: In regular course of business we now come to No. 10, "Communications • and Bills." It has been suggested that we suspend the rules and pass "Election of New Members" and the applications offered for. election. ■: Before we proceed, there will be an applica- . tion for Scranton. Pa., from Reese & Long. Unless Mr. Beltz is dropped, there can be no action taken. Mr. Steinbrenner: Mr. President, I wish to state that I have an application from Reese & Long for Dunsmore. If that is not in the same county as Scranton. they have two membership fees to Pennsylvania. President: If I understand you correctly. ■ their application covers territory not covered at this time. On motion, made and duly seconded and put before the house, Messrs. Reese & Long were elected'for the territory not covered. Me Murphy is introduced. President: We sent for yoif, Mr. Murphy, on account of-an application for membership in this association, and we all wanted to see you. I extend you a hearty welcome. Mr. Murphy: Am I elected, or'not? President: Tou are not. -; Mr^. Murphy: Then I. can not thank the gentlemen.:.. This application of Mr. Murphy was under the firm name of The American Bill Posting & Distributing Co., Brooklyn} N. Y. Mr. Leonard: Mr^President- As a member of this association. I have, been to Brooklyn- four times: I have known Mr. Murphy for nearly thirty years; they have,- one of the " finest plants for bill posting in the city. We want a good representative in Brooklyn. I don't know of a man who will fii}: the bill any better than Mr. Murphy. " President: Mr. Murphy, I would like to ask you.a question: 'Which branch of this business do you keep upstairs, bill posting or distributing—which one-do you hold in ad- vance? Do you set as much store on one as on the other? Mr. Murphy;. I have always made my money on bill posting—made more from that than distributing. President: But whatever distributing' you get, you get it with the same desire to have it as well done as your bill posting? Mr. Murphy: Everything we have done in the last thirty-five years we have done to the best of our ability. Motion made and duly seconded, placed be- fore the house by the President: Mr. Murphy is unanimously elected. Calls for "Speech! Speech!" by the entire convention. Mr. Murphy: Mr. Chairman and Gentle- men.—I hope you will only expect m» to pay that I am thankful to you on behalf of the American Bill Posting & Distributing Co.; very thankful to you. one and all. We have an application from Charles O Miller. Millersburg. O.' This application is signed by men who I have no doubt are per- fectly reliable. . Mr. Hill moves that Mr. Miller be received as a member. Motion duly seconded and put to the house by the President. Mr. Miller unanimously elected. President: We shall .expect a speech from you. Mr. Miller. Mr. Miller: Mr. President and Gentlemen.— I am very much obliged to you; I will try to do my duty as a distributor—not being a speech maker, you must excuse me. We have one more application which has not been acted upon—that of DeLong & Bied- erman. of Joliet. III. On motion, duly seconded and put to the house. Messrs. DeLong & iBederman were unanimously elected. President: Mr. DeLong, you pre unani- mously elected, and a speech is celled for. A member: Now Is the chance of your life. Mr. DeLong: You say it is the chance of my life. If I serve this association as I served Uncle Sam from 1861 to 1865, I will do myself proud—I got a discbarge with eleven engagements on it. Cheers. Secretary: If Mr. DeLong serves the asso- ciation as he has Uncle Sam, it will be a life- time job. President: We will now attend to the tenth order of business, "Communications aud Bills." Secretary: I wish to say, before going to any other business, there was an application to be made out for a Buffalo firm. President: While ycu make it out, we will call on the Executive Committee to make a report of these cases. Mr. Douglass: Mr. President. I have been delegated the duty of making the report for the committee. Will say that we have sev- eral cases: the one calling for the most care and trouble was the Heverin case, of Louis- ville, Ky.. about which I had three or four letters. We gave the case our thorough and" careful consideration: we had charges pre- ferred from one or two firms for bad service, and we unanimously agreed that Heverin be dropped. ■ There was the case of John H. Owen, De- troit, Mich. About the only thing we found was that Mr. Owen had made a fool contract. We disposed of the matter by having Mr. Owen satisfy the advertiser, and the Presi- dent issued a reprimand. There are the four members, M. Weintraub & Co., W. A. Waters. W. W. Wakefield and Maurice Weintraub. whose names have been already dropped on account of being delin- quent in payment of dues. In regard to the complaint in writing against John H. Beltz. of Scranton, Pa., we agree that Mr. Beltz should be dropped from the asEociation, leaving a vacancy which is now ready to be filled. In regard to the charge against Charles W. Keogh, of Charleston, S. C, I believe it is " not only the feeling of the committee, but of the entire membership, that his name should be dropped. Mr. Steinbrenner: Mr. President, we have an application from Buffalo, (including Ton- awanda). from Whitmere & Fillbrick, in- dorsed by Mr. Otting, Mr. Ramsey and Mr. Leonard. It was moved and seconded that the annli- . cation should be accepted on recommendation. Motion unanimously carried. Mr. Leonard states in substances that he was located in a county where there -were several good towns, but he did not think it was for the good of the associatin that he. or anyone, should be entitled ti the contol of all the towns in his county unless he paid th a stipulated fee for each town; if he wished to control three or four towns, he should take out an application for each town Member: It was my understanding that it was not the county I paid tax on, but the population. President: Gentlemen, we will come to the discussion of this subject in a short time. We will now go back to No. 10, "Communications and Bills." Mr. Steinbrenner: Mr. President. I would say that all the bills we have are included in my report already read. President: Gentlemen, lest some of you might think that the office of President was a salaried office. I want to sav my business transactions are all in the hands of the Sec- retary. I desire to say that I send out all the certificates: each one costs about four cents; in addition to that. I send a letter two cents' postage. My bill of $21 was all accounted for in proper form each quarter- • it eoes in the way stated, not as salary. Secretary: We will read a letter from Wildes Brothers, general advertising ag°uts and distributors, Portland, Maine, dated June 17, 1898. (Reads letter.) Mr. Murpby: Mr. Secretary, have you many more letters like that: if you have I must be excused to take a drink. Mr. Pease states that he dislikes to inter- rupt the order of business, but it is necessary tor him to go home, and asks to leave some of his little booklets for distribution among •f ™ emocrs of the association, that he soon intended to send out in a large quantity for distribution throughout the country. Mr. Leonard begs to inform the gentlemen tnat any town he sends work to. and it Is not properly done, to inform the Secretary Mr. Faircbild thinks It a good idea if th" advertisers watch the distributors and report to the Secretary if work is not well done. Secretary reads a letter from Mr. John T Hudson, Pittsburg, Pa., Second Vice Presi- dent. A letter reed from Valle & Bro. Advertising K-m^TSr'"?' 7 ex . as - A Ietter T ' aa tTom Killmore Chemical Co.. Fletcher. O. Com- rnumoation- from D. .T. LeFebre Advertising Co., Manchester. N. H.. in which "The Bill- board" was criticized, which letter it was moved to lay on the tabic. Motion carried. Mr. Steinbrenner: Mr. President. I wonH live to say in ro Ea rrl to "The Billboard." I think we owe "Tho Billboard" more than any one individual. They stood by us when we had no money; they printed our advertise- ment when we did not have anv chance it seemed to pay them, and they told me that If «■'" could net P8v. they would make us a and Secretary of the Cincinnati League Letters of Invitation also read from M Maybury, Mayor of Detroit; O. A. Bicrce' Secretary of the Detroit Convention and Busu ness Men a League; also, letter read from W S. Plngrce. Governor of Michigan Mr. Leonard: We met in Detroit a few years ago. and they had a big fire for our en- tertainment. Secretary: We also have from Detroit, as follows: TH~ BILLBOARD two telegrams 'International Association of Distributors In Convention Assembled, Lcland Hotel cm cago: Business Mens League sends cordial S" C n t J. n , B !.. an . d H r8 T 8 favor »ble consideration of^Detroit s InvitatlonB. O. A. Blerce, Secre- Also a telegram from the Mayor, as follows- ..a. . . ., "Detroit, Mich., July 19, 1898. ' To International Association of Distributors Leland Hotel: "On behalf of our citizens. I desire to renew invitation to meet in Detroit next year We want you to hold your deliberations here and partake of our hospitality. m v . 'l M A C C MAYBURY, Mayor." Mr. Krutz. of Goshen, Ind., offers the fol- lowing resolution: "Resolved, That this as- sociation extend an invitation to the Ameri- can Bill Posting Co.; C. B. Hood & Co., of- ficial solicitors of the Associated Bill Post- «„ S A T., C ' aH . < ! n , : !° e £r A - Trcyscr. of the Na- tional Advertising Bureau, official solicitor and the Chicago Bill Posting Co.. to the P rl v : ilege of the floor of this convention." President: I will say that we are pretty well along with our list; there will be time enough this afternoon to hear them if thev are not too lengthy. * A motion was made to the effect that all the parties named in the resolution should be invited to the privileges of the floor during the session. Being duly seconded and put to the vote of the house by the President, It was unanimously carried. Mr Fairchild: Mr. President. I think we had better set a time—I. for one, want to be at the association all the time; there is a great deal for us to do, if we do it right- there is no use for us to come here unless we can be benefited. Mr. Grebe: I move you. we invite the gen- tlemen to the privileges of the floor to-mor- row afternoon at 3 o'clock. The motion, being duly seconded, was put to the vote of the house by the President, and unanimously carried. ^ The matter of having the photograph of the association taken In a body was discussed 7„ii^n ,8 .!? ecidcd J hat 9 "'dock. Wednesday. July 20. the association would assemble In a ^ y i, on th ^ Btep ,? of tne Flne Art Building and have their photograph taken; the Secre- tary stating that all those who desired one of the pictures could have same at one dollar f5S : i?1 ?. ne WaB under any obligation what- ever, but it was greatly desired that all would dg present. A night session was favored by some of the members, but it was finally decided not to Jh^USf. 1 ev ™L nB 3 "» any ™ te - "many o? the gentlemen had been traveling all night and were tired out. "'sm.. ••i P ££!i d t. n y ^' e . wl " now take up No. 12. h^ flD , lsh f d k Bus 'ness." You can spend an hour right here in good, hard work. Mr. Fairchild: Mr. President. I am a very Pa, 0r „ tfl,ker ' l" 1 , 1 thlnk every «"«» can ref- late his own business if he will do good wSric and do it as he contracts to do. There U no need to have "cheduled prices. In fact I ad- E ted '' "t the meeting at Cincinnati but I S* » , me to the conclusion that you can't d J? 11 . I .'L evfry roan *"» do his work well !^ the advertiser will go away satisfied and get good results from your work, you can f£ ^ Jl Tlcea - l B€t * 2 ' «-25 and $2 5o" and they don't complain about it. I believe all good g wU 0 ° d Pr ' CeS " they Wi » a '"»£ o" e„ P £!f ident: J wi8h ' sentlemen. you would m»M, ei. y T r 8peecnes to five minutes; as m , U . P . h .i E !: orl ' , , r as you Please-as a starter. I WAffir l ° he " Mr - *T "* Mr. Ramsey: Mr. President. In regard to srair-J Sh ' th "\ k " proper to establish a fhf L C H,. Prlce8 . un|pss u °e the minimum; {»hii?h n «,H IMons of . cl,ies do not warrant an <*- tabllshed price: it would shut us out entirely if you raised the price to, say. $2 or 12 50 All we have to do Is to stay where we are and do good work, and when we arTstTonger and better known we can demand our prices nr C8l n. n vK We . wi » h-ar from Dr. Burl/hart! Pr«irt« B . Ur ^ hart: We "' ' can J"st say. Mr hZZnZ I; l """lo'tc a novice in this work h'J- ..■ . f^ ',' much thought; I have only been distributing circulars about seveb Se 0 ,".^"- r have b ' a a *°o d dea ' of this work fnTnl'S 2K.T"- "1- •■ different town,"* present of it. I think we tret a great manv more free reafline notices than we pay for I am not saying thi- because they are personal friends of mine. My first thought was not to bring this letter f> the convention, but ho (LeFebre) was entitlert to have it read Member: I think "The Billboard" has been doing all that it. posrthlv could for the asso- ciation : the only trouble is the association .1 mb t, re do not wr <te more for it; I concur with him In reference to the "Ajax" letter I live in a small town, and I did not write * J* ' thi-k "The Billboard" knows what is right, and I am sure it knows how to mease the association. President: As thiB letter is tabled that cer- tainly ought to satisfy "The Billboard." City Nj read fr ° m J ' F ' °' MeaIl8 ~ Jersey Secretary: We have Invitations from Cln- r!I»I and P e „ troit tj>T our next convention. Letter read from Gustav Tafel, Mayor of Cincinnati, and a letter from the President think it »ui * n \uZ a In d>nercnt towns. I ei»Ji7„. l » "' De tn f be* policy of the asso- ciation if you could possibly adopt a fixed scale of prices. My Idea has been to adapt i^H P £ lc f 8 at- cordlng to the work distributed and to the population of the town. Say a JSrt-in ™i° f '7"" flv . c t0 twenty thousand, a Ttan?» t n «' ce . : fro . m i wonty thousand Inhab- itants to seventy-live thousand, another r.n Ln 7 d ,rcm 7S ' 000 to I" 0 - 0 *" Population still another price. I think just as soon as y h°» »^ an Cffbllsh these priced y„„ wUl dS ^inf""'!". 110 " g00d: therc wl » be less com- rin,, 1 - /" you wl " n8vc to do will be to senfl out your scheduled nrlce. and we will ell know that we are all the time Retting tho cuTl'v^nT; Th ^ C '2 a "'"a? e de 8 fll of *d.ffl- nilrt %l ~. nB ,rom lhc di-tributors having no « W h, w~ n "»r ,an w "' ta "e the work at »lnn» ...i™* " l M c l : an °thcr man will come L*,l d f, ay ; "», haven't anything to do?I ™Al . Il tn 7 ]PBS " An advertiser will nT hMnf* 8nd K,V ,? you nlB wo "-k at 1250 not being very well up in the advertls ni w U » 8 ,H nCS r : h « c *S cot,la your offer of $2 50^ after- Wa » rd "i ne . flndB m,t th "' the same man has done similar work for 11.25. and he loses co" ?nS i7\.' n thc d strlbutor in a business way. and If he can get another man to do his work the f«i m Ti,'i e . wl11 do "• or course I relllzo the fart that the association is practically In not 2™ y - Bul th . cre lB no "'"on It «hou!8 not grow to a grand work. It Is a grand field hy nroper and strict attention, honesty and it will be a grand work, one that you will all UmeTwnn „ n nd " may bc ' at «•• PrcUnt time I would not recommend that you fix a s.-iile of- prices, but It should be arranged at !!,.'• earliest possible date. President: Now, Mr. Leonard, we will hear Mr Leonard: Mr. President. As far as iliMiibuting circulars Is concerned, I make It noint to employ men only; my rates have •ilways been from $1.50 to $2 per thousand; • hire has never been over 25 cents profit on , thousand. I have raised my prices from il -,o to $1.75 this year; I have written to each ;,["„„ customers that I could not do the work f,ir liss and everyone says: "Go ahead, and Live us the same service you have been glv- inK " 1 pay iuy mcn a Co!lar a day - • do noi" think any man who can do good, flret- , I iss work can be secured for less than a dol- lar a day. I don't think any of us ought to ■ 'innloy boys. Where you give a man good service he will not object If you raise your mi, is I think in any ordinary town $1.75 is •in average price, and is small enough. ' Mr Curran: Mr. President. Therc is hard- iv aiiv work we do for less than $2 per thou- sand or $2.50 and $3. Wc did a lot of work for the Allen's Foot Ease Co.; wc sampled ■.even towns and got $2 a thousand. I went down to see him at Buffalo: he showed me a ii«t of his work he had done at $1.75 per thou- sand 1 made a compromise for 33.000 at $2 a thoutand, and got 3,000 cards at $20 a thou- sand lie told me he got cards In Chicago at a cent and a cent and a half—but l.told him that I guaranteed good advertising. I believe in getting $3 a-thousand, and no less. Anv town we cannot give out 3,000 circulars in "we get 50 cents a hundred. I don't care who the advertiser is: if good, he will not object to fair prices for good service. Some bill potters will post a sheet of paper at four cents a month: now. I get 12 cents a month. I want it to be understood that no man car distilbute at less than $2 a thousand. I con- sider that we can not distribute more than «ix to eight hundred in a day of ten hours and 1 pay $1.50 per day for distributors Mr Otting: Mr. President. 1 want to tell vou there is certainly a minimum price, be- iow which work can not be done at a profit, no matter what the town, or what the section of the country, or what the characteristics of thc town may' be. Therefore, as this asso- ciation has grown, in my estimation, to be a creat big. powerful association, and as there is behind this association an absolute guar- antee for good service. I think this associa- tion has a duty to pe.-form—that is. to estab- lish a ir-inimum price, and make that mini- mum high enough to be profitable, for, unless profitable, it will never amount to much as a business. I would earnestly enjoin you to adopt a rcirimum price, and as soon as pos- sible to adopt a rigid and fixed price. J. H. Crownover: 1 have as large a busi- ness as any one here: we have various prices: competition is strong. There are no less than twelve or fourteen men in the business who will make bids from 75 cents to $2 per thou- sand and a great many advertisers arc taken advantage of. Dr. Miles' man came through rey territory some time ago and was looking for a man who would do the work at $1.25 per thousand. In my cities, St. Paul and Minne- eapolis. work can not be done at the same prices; owing to the way the cities are built. one is mire ccm-art than the other. I emrloy men only: I have placed 660.000 pieces this season, and I have about 90.000 pieces of ad- vertising matter to place in the next month: I employ six men and pay them $1 a day. and when out far from home, I furnish lunch. I think at the present time if a scale of prices were fixed for my territory it would drive me out of the bUFiness: I have done work at $1.50 and $1.75. and mrde very little; I sometimes t»ke work at $1.25 just to keep my men em- ployed. I have'raised my prices on most of my work now, eince I have established my reputation. I think it would be an absurd thing to fix a Ecale of prices. Mr. Crownover said much more along this line. Mr. Hill: Mr. President. I agree with almost everything that has been said in the convention In the South and Southwest there are fewer di«tributors who actually irake a tu l"ess cf distriluting than there are in thc North and Northeast; for that reason, there is less matter sent out than further East: therefore, for that reason. It is harder for a distributor to get a good price. Now. if you arc going to lay down a fixed price, I think it should be a minimum price. Mr. Murphy: Mr. President. I believe a prcat deal of time is being lost in this discus- sion. I believe as Mr. Fairchild dors—let ev- ery man run bis own business, and do it hon- cftly. We ought to know just as well about it as somebody a thousand miles away. Mr. Steinbrenner: I think there is one other point that has aot been touched on yet. In regard to pric s. One firm will come into a city and make six distributions a year, while other firms will not come but once a year. 1 think a distributor can afford to work for less for one than for tho other: then, again, there are firms who advertise, and we are doubt- ful whrthrr we will gel our money, and we have a right to charge something extra for the risk. Say, for instance, the Dr. Chase Co. 1 am working on thc sixth distribution in thc layt twrlvc months, while we have other firms who come once a year only. Again, in thc I'r. Chase work I have the whole territory: other; firms, after I have made a price, try to shirt me out In some suburb. 1 think I ought t" have a right to charge what 1 like. Mr. Grebe: Mr. President. I think thc only show Is to adopt a minimum price; we all know It costs just about so much to get out anything—therc may be some occasions when you want to cut low, to get out and underbid your competitor. Mr. Otting: Mr. President. Let tho asso- ciation do something towards tho advance- ment of prices. I think now is thc time to reiec thc prices to at least $2 a thousand, or Jl.7r. as a minimum. To facilitate matters. I i-hould like for this to be put before the ""Use. Mr. Ilamsey: Let $1.50 be tho minimum. Mr. Curran: Mr. Prcrldcnt. Just one mo- ment. Our Bill PoBters' Association went through all this price business; we raised our inices from five to six cents per sheet, and ■ionic of our men said they would be afraid to i'*k that price, but WP stuck to it. and now I am getting twelve cents per sheet. If we do good, satisfactory work, no reliable firm will take their work from you on account of your price. We might at least establish a mini- mum price. Mr. Dixon, of Milwaukee: Mr. President Our association is in its infancy; for the good and benefit of ail we must handle this thing with gloved hands. A distributor will never be able to get enough for his work. I bdicve the price is low now. but we are not the only distributors on earth. If we, as dis- tributors of this association, should fix a scale of prices commensurate with our woik, these advertisers would turn from us and we would lose our trade. I know these advcitisers. I employ nobody but men. I can not make more than 25 cents on the thousand at $1.50. I put out in Milwaukee, 50,000 pieces, working five to tix men. But I know if the price was fixeo for the City of Milwaukee, they could net be fixed so as to help my brothers in the smaller towns. I think the best thing we can do it. to work for the good of the association and compromise the matter, and lit it go un- til we come back next year; then we may be prepared to do something with this question. Mr. Marvin: I am not an orator. I will say that in small towns, not more than loo population. I distribute for $1 a town; then again, where there are 4.000 I charge $4 a thousand; ttis is otUida of Au:ora; in Aurora ... . - .... ..-^.w .U:—.k— _*..-£j lished this scclo. If we cculd do th-.it, 1 wcu'd gladly enter into the arrangement. I have one of the most scattering territories; in some of thc district to be gone over, the residences are far apart and high up: others are built close together on 25-foot lots. Some parts of the town could be gone over at $1 a thou- sand with more profit than other parts at $3 a thousand, and I think these conditions pre- vail all over the country. The question under discussion: Can we fix a price for St. Louis. St. Paul. Minneapolis, and all the other towns? Take St. Louis, for instance; a man can put a thousand pieces out at a profit at $1 a thousand, come right up to Alton and put them out at $1.50, and he will lose money —I could net make even a minimum price; go to small towns, where a man can not put out more than 500 to 3,500, and it is worth $5 a thousand. How are you going to do it for less? You ask to have a minimum price, but I say that I want to run my business myself. Applause. Mr. Ramsey: Mr. President, I move that we lay this matter on the table for another year. Motion seconded. President: It is moved and seconded that this matter, the establishing of a scale of prices, or even a minimum price, be laid on the table until our next annual meeting. Mr. Leonard asks to amend the motion, to wrn^M i&i&isip- 5 * . "■'-■' 1 1 ¥%&}&fi-Zff' : i&; r-.-ts.-JV-.-i-;---'"----.--C-Vv.- :\ '■- "-».?>"-?>' '■■ ■- -' J. G. SIMPSON, Of San Francisco, CaL, V.'c: President of the A. B. P. A. we distribute at $2 and $1.75: usual'y S2. and guarantee the tdv.-r isir. Wc utc no.Lins b. t men to do this work. ■ Mi. Tirrill: Mr. President. I consider this a very serious question, and one that must be handled very carefully. In distributing, the conditions and service vary, aud the price must necessarily vary. Ycu can distribute some matter at a certain price and make a profit. There is a vast difference in thc re- quirements of firms: some require you to put a circular at the door: others require you to put it inside of the house, and you can't do one at the same price as the other. Again. If wc establish a price that Is too high, there are no advertisers controlled by this associa- tion who can be compelled to give their work to the members of this association. Any man can be a distributor; no capital is required; a man need not even own a team of horses and a wagon. A man can go into the dis- tributing business without investing a dol- lar, and it he is disposed to do so he can go into a town and pick up a man to do thc work for thc advertiscr.and not always even work himself. I think the only thing to do is to allow the price to rest with the distrib- utor. Undoubtedly, it would be a good thing if this association was powerful enough, to make a scale of prices, but 1 don't think we have arrived at that state yet. and it is a question in my mind whether we ever can. Mr. Held, the President: Gentlemen.—I have some ideas, but I am too much one- sided, hardly to be permitted to speak on t'<ts question. Thc bill posters have undoubtcdly establishrd a priry and mode a success, but they arc so different; they have sheets, and they have boards to put up. and they have horses and wagons. I don't see that they have but very little competition in their business. They have a scale of prices that is commend- able; they cct their prices by having cstab- the effect that the President appoint a com- mittee of three or five to decide the matter before the next convention. President: I decline to do that. The con- vention can appoint a committee. I am too biased in my views to appoint a just com- mittee. Cries of "Question! Question!" President: You have all heard the motion, that the scale of prices, as well as thc mini- mum of prices, be tabled for one year. Motion unanimously carried. Motion made to adjourn, to meet on the steps of the Art Institute at 9 a. m. Motion carried. Adjourned. WEDNESDAY MORNING. JULY 20, 1S9S. 10:30 a. m.—Meeting called to order by the President. President Gentlemen. It is now past the hour that wc should have come together, but 1 think it would be wise to permit the vis- itors who are present to talk at this time, as some of them want to leave. I think we have a representative of the Dr. Chase Medicine .Co.: and also of the Dr. Miles Medicine Co. with us. We will open with a talk from the representative of Dr. Miles, inasmuch as I am acquainted with you. Mr. Hayes. E. C. Beardslcy. of Ellshart: Mr. President and Gentlemen.—I came over, not to talk, but to listen, and perhaps to look. I had some curiosity, and I must say that I am very much pleased with what I have seen and heard. When this orgtnization was first started, we felt very much like encouraging it: wc believed it was organized on a proper basis; we believed it would lift the work of distributing out of the gutter and garbage, and I congratulate you, gentlemen, on the progress you have made. The business of distributing circulars has been In the past a picked-up business. I am gl-d you have made it a first-class business. We have been very much pleased with the work you have done for us except in one or two cases, and in each case such complaint as we have made has been promptly attended to. There We one or two things necessary in order to get good results. In the first place, the distrib- utor should do bis work well and right; we believe the proprietor should pay his em- plcy s rntugh to enable good woik to be done. I was in a city a few weeks ago and saw a man distributing. I asked him if he usually did bis work in that way—he belonged to a big concern. He said: "No: but we arc only paid a dollar a thousand, and we can't afford to do it any better." I said: "If you are do- ing distributing for a living you can not af- ford to do It at all: you could not get a job from us. If you work at a price that you can't afford to do your work well, you can't afford to do it at all: you are casting dis- repute on the work of distributing. As 1 say. I am very glad to meet you. gentlemen, col- lectively, and I congratulate you again on the progress you are making, and extend to you, each, individually, a kindly invitation to call on us at any time when you are near enough to come. Applause. Mr. Hayes: Mr. President and Gentlemen. —I have nothing to say. I have done my share In giving the boys what I can to dis- tribute. I am not a speech-maker, but a dis- tributor. Applause. Mr. Tirrill: I think Mr. Hayes has been around with most of the boys. Mr. Steinbrenner: I think Mr. Burnhams is the manager of the distributing department of the Miles concern, and I know we all would like to hear from him. Mr. Burnhams begged to be excused. Mr. Runey was called on next. Mr. Runey: All I can say about the Cali- fornia Co. is that Its distributors double up occasionally. We like to have our matter put out separately and alone. President: Did you ever hear of any of that sort of work done by any member of this as- sociation ? Mr. Runey: No: we are very much afraid of that sort of man, consequently we favor the International Association. We send men out very frequently ourselves to do our dis- tributing. I could mention a good many towns where this doubljng-up Is done. I think it food for thought- President: I thought perhaps you had some one In mind who was a member of this asso- ciation, and if so I should like for you to make a charge direct- Mr. Hessler: Mr. President and Gentlemen. —This is the first time I ever had a chance to make a speech In a convention, and I am quite a distance away from home and a little afraid of the cars. (President: We all expect to be benefited, and there are no cars here.l I publish the Two Bills and the Ga- zetteer. I think most of the members have received one. Anything I can do to help the distributors, I should like to have the pleas- ure of doing it. •»«=»• President: If there are any gentlemen with us who make a business of distributing who are not members of the association, we would oe glaa to hear from them. Mr. Crownover: There is a gentleman hero from Freeport. Mr Waller, of Freeport: I have been en- gaged in distributing for the last ten years. I find there is a great deal of poor distribut- ing done in Freeport, (not by me. but by some other men.) I have a good trade so far; I do my work right and good, and I would like to Join this association; and will agree to stick by the association. President: We should like to hear from Mr. Runey. Mr. Runey, Jr.: Mr. President. Mr. Runey is my father: he does the distributing in Waukegan. He usually gets about $175 for distributing. He takes two men and one goes on each side of the street through the town; each takes as many circulars as he thinks It will take to cover one particular district or street; he thinks this gives the best satisfaction. President: I think it would be a good idea if some of the other distributors would tell us how they distribute their circulars. Mr. De Long, of Joliet: Mr. President, w« have a member here right from the State capital, where they are thought to do good work—Brother Horn. Mr. Horn: Gentlemen.—I have been in the bill posting and distributing business for four years now, and have never had any trouble with any work except once, and it was not poor service took that work away—it was spite work, and after some difficulty I got the matter settled up. We do our work with boys. We have found that you have to watch men just as much as you do boys. We get good boys, who come out of the schools: do not take boys raised n the street. You have to pay a man from a dollar to one-fifty a day. while you can get a boy for 50 cents a day. It don't pay to send out either boys or men unless you watch them. I have had good suc- cess with boys, and I hope to be a member of this association. President: I would like to inquire what aged boys you use? *. Mr. Horn: From fifteen years of age up. Another thing I have to say; the opposition in a town is one of the things the association has to work to put down. There are lots of agents who get the money and pay the men on the spot; the agent hires men to put out the work; sometimes he stays there and watches them. I have had agents come to me and give the bill of lading to me. and I went after the work. These agents are sent out to watch the work, but it is the distributor who is responsible and has the work done. If a man comes to me and asks my price, and he then asks if I have any opposition in the town I always tell him "Yes." I will not stand in any man's way. I get six or seven cents a sheet for posting, while the Opera Co. will put it up for two or three cents a month. For distributing. I get $1.75 a thousand: I used to distribute for $1.50. but have gone up on my prices, and the firm I have worked for the last four years wrote me that they would ship me their work at the advanced price. President: Are you & member of the In- ternational Association of Distributors?. if